Wednesday, March 28, 2007

A look at UND's new Spiritual Center

Here are some images of what UND's new Hopper-Danley Spiritual Center will look like when it is completed this May. According to the Center's website, the chapel will be available for meditation, prayer, small worship groups, and weddings.


You might find it interesting to compare these with the first rendering. I like both designs, but the one they finally went with will probably fit in better on campus. What do you think?
Images - University of North Dakota

51 comments:

dale said...

I prefer the first one (the yellowish one,) but I suppose that the second one (with all the bricks,) fits into campus better.

Anonymous said...

Let's just hope all are welcomed equally: Jews, Muslims, Christians, Non-Believers.

Anonymous said...

Let's just hope all are welcomed equally: Jews, Muslims, Christians, Non-Believers.

Anonymous said...

All? How about Muslim Extremists?

dale said...

Let's just hope all are welcomed equally: Jews, Muslims, Christians, Non-Believers.

Given the lack of a cross, Star of David, or Darwin fish poster in the pictures, I'd say that would be the case. I don't know what the Islam, Buddhist or Norse Mythos symbol would be, but I don't see any of those either.

So it's more of a "we don't care what (or if) you believe, come by for a cup of coffee, non-secular worship (or not) and promotion of nothing. Sit in the chairs and see if something inspires your spirit. Or doesn't inspire your non-spirit, we don't want to presume."

Blech. When I die, I want to leave enough money to force them to put up a 50 foot "Praise Jesus" neon sign like Gene Scott had in Los Angeles. I'd encourage the affluent Muslim, Hindu or atheist to do the same thing.

If you wanna make a statement, at least have an opinion.

bethski said...

This building seems to render completely pointless. What a waste.

Anonymous said...

I wonder if it will be available for events other than weddings? UND is sorely lacking in events space--it sure would be nice to be able to use the space for that sort of thing.

Coffee Guy said...

All? How about Muslim Extremists?

And what about Christian extremists?

Anonymous said...

One blows up innocent children and one doesn't.

Anonymous said...

UND has NO business being in the catering/banquet industry!!!

ec99 said...

"Gene Scott"

Is he still alive?

Anonymous said...

Let's just hope all are welcomed equally: Jews, Muslims, Christians, Non-Believers.
The absurdity of this statement is unbelievable. Yet this kind of PC garbage thrown out by intellectual types and never challenged.

Why would non-believers, who don't even recognize spirituality as a life element, go to a spirituality center?

The statement is like saying let's hope vegetarians are welcomed at steak houses, celiacs are welcomed at Panera Bread, recovering alcoholics at a bar, or a diabetic in a candy store.

ec99 said...

"Why would non-believers, who don't even recognize spirituality as a life element, go to a spirituality center?"

Seems like you're committing the fallacy of making non-belief and spirituality mutually exclusive.

dale said...

"Gene Scott"

Is he still alive?


Nope, he went to that Great Racetrack in the sky a few years ago.

However, he lives on through the magic of video tape... you can still catch him (and his trophy bride) in all his goofiness on Channel 9 in the Forks late night.

"Now git on the phone!"

Coffee Guy said...

One blows up innocent children and one doesn't.

Christian extremists don't kill innocent children? Wow.

Lynsey said...

With all those windows, I feel like that building is going to be really cold in the winter, and unfortunately, vandalized.

Anonymous said...

"The statement is like saying let's hope vegetarians are welcomed at steak houses, celiacs are welcomed at Panera Bread, recovering alcoholics at a bar, or a diabetic in a candy store."

This is so typical of Christianity today. If you don't beleive in MY God, MY Bible, MY view of the world, we don't want you. What if someone is contemplating the origins of the world? Should they be forbidden to enter?

Anonymous said...

Have no innocent children been killed by our soldiers in Iraq?

Anonymous said...

Thanks for completely idiotic rhetorical question, you bring dumbass to a whole new level.

dale said...

This is so typical of Christianity today. If you don't beleive in MY God, MY Bible, MY view of the world, we don't want you.

That would be an evangelical view, yes. Not "typical of Christianity today," which runs the spectrum. And it's irrelevant, anyway, as this is, as I noted above, a "spiritual centre" not a Christian or Jewish or Flying Spaghetti Monster centre. The original poster's comment was more to the effect of "if you don't believe in sprituality, why would you go to a spiritual centre?"

That said, if you don't believe in God or Christ, you're welcome to come to my church. But, while you're there, don't start preaching to me about atheism, or act all confused or put off if the members of the congregation start telling you about our faith.

Have no innocent children been killed by our soldiers in Iraq?

Were the conflict in Iraq a "Christian war," such a statement would have credibility. It isn't, so it doesn't.

If you want to make an argument, cite the Crusades or Spanish Inquisition, for pete's sake. Might as well even drag up the Salem Witch Trials, for that matter. Those make for easy pickings.

Coffee Guy said...

President Bush has stated on record that God talks to him directly, and told him to go to war. That sounds like religious extremism to me.

dale said...

I make no claims about the sanity of the current president. But I do stand by my belief that this is not a Christian -v- Muslim conflict. Call it a personal vendetta against Saddam, call it "war for oil," or call it a war on terrorism, but, without a valid cite, don't call it a religious war.

This isn't a monarchy or dictatorship -- without the support of the 2003 Congress and the rest of his administration, Bush could not have gone to war, regardless of whether or not he believed that God was in favour of it. You want to call him a putz, fine, but without Cheney, Rumsfeld and whatever motivations they had (which I've never heard anyone argue were religious in nature,) we'd have kept our noses out of Iraq.

Coffee Guy said...

I'm not sure if you're talking to me, because I never said that this was a Christian vs. Muslim war. I'll pipe in, however.

I'm countering the claim that Christian extremists, such as President Bush, don't kill children. Just because he isn't the one holding the gun or at the button of the rocket launcher doesn't mean the blood isn't on his hands, as he's the one claiming to be doing God's work.

Anonymous said...

Coffee Guy, I love your dumbass logic..."I don't like President Bush, so I'll support the Muslim Extremists".

Absolute brilliance!!!

dale said...

If you can find me a cite of Bush (or anyone in power, for that matter,) saying "I want you to indiscriminately bomb civilian areas because God told me that it's the right thing to do," I'll concede the point.

Because that's what "muslim extremists" (whatever that works out to be,) are accused of doing, and by your equating Christian and Muslim extremists, you've put the two on a par.

Coffee Guy said...

I do? Really? That's news to me.

Coffee Guy said...

Religious extremists do harmful things for religious reasons. There are plenty of Muslim and other extremists who have never killed children. To specify that as the dictating factor is quite shortsighted.

Fed Up with PC-ness said...

I, for one, think a little "Christian Extremism" would be welcome in this day and age. I would NEVER provoke a fight with, or push my religion on, a person of another faith (or non-faith as it were), but if a Muslim/Atheist/Hebrew/Wiccan/Whatever starts shooting at me, or bombs my home in the name of their cause, I would kill their heathen ass and pray to Christ the Redeemer to forgive their trespasses.

THAT should be the view of the modern day Christian... "NEVER provoke, forgive the trespass, but respond with equal or greater force."

"Turn the Other Cheek" only applies when you get slapped or insulted, not when you get shot or stabbed. I am able to hold intelligent, thoughtful conversations with people about religion. Mind you, I'm never the one to bring it up, because it's a conversation you can only have with rational people, and you never know who might flip out on you these days. But if someone flips on me and does anything that might cause permanant damage to me or my family, I WILL FIGHT BACK...HARD. The time to answer Muslim Extremist fire with equal or overwhelming fire has come. I have no more cheeks to turn...

dale said...

Well, I see that this little conversation has gone pretty far afield from the original post :-)

I think I'll just bring up the Nazis ("Hitler was a pagan extremist, you know",) invoke Godwin's Law on myself and duck out.

See ya in the next "Best Coffee Shop" thread.

Coffee Guy said...

Hitler was a Christian, albeit a messed up one. He advocated Positive Christianity.

OK, let's bring it back.

I'm not a religious person, but love sitting quietly in peaceful places. I hope this spiritual center is such a place.

wolfgf said...

" I, for one, think a little "Christian Extremism" would be welcome in this day and age."

So if extremists of one particular religion were to bomb you, you'd bomb anyone of that faith? I doubt you believe that, but that's what you're saying. And it's extremism of YOUR type that's just as dangerous...because words incite hatred and violence.

Fed up with PC-ness said...

OK,

#1. Godwin's Law is hilarious, I'd never heard of that until now. Kudos to Dale.

#2. Wolfgf, read my post again...s-l-o-w-l-y this time, and maybe you will see that I said that I would retaliate against whomever attacked me with religious intent, not the whole faith. I don't think I would go into a randomly picked mosque and kill everyone, women and children included, if I was attacked by a Muslim Extremist (and for the record, I don't think our soldiers are doing that either!)

I'm saying that it's time to start putting this thing into perspective, Muslim Extremists are waging Jihad on Christians and Hebrews and Christian and Hebrew majority nations. They don't hate me and my country because I own a Nintendo, or listen to Modest Mouse, or wear blue jeans, they hate me because I do not follow the Islamo-Fascist rules of law. They hate Hebrews for the same reason. This absolutely IS a religious war, and Christians need to take it seriously. Trust me when I say that the Hebrews aready are.

GrandForksGuy said...

Ummm...guys...this post is about an all-faiths chapel being built on the UND campus...did you forget?

wolfgf said...

YOU SAID: If a Muslim/Atheist/Hebrew/Wiccan/Whatever starts shooting at me, or bombs my home in the name of their cause, I would kill their heathen ass and pray to Christ the Redeemer to forgive their trespasses.

You said "if A (meaning one) Muslim...starts shooting at me...I would kill THEIR (meaning all or most) heathen ass."

Those were YOUR words not mine. Sounds like "many eyes for an eye", to me. That's why I gave you the benefit of a doubt and said I didn't think you meant what you said. But at least take responsibility for your words.

mattfacingsouth said...

"Islamo-Fascist"

Hook, line, and sinker...

Anonymous said...

Matt, you're an idiot. Get down to Corporate Headquarters and pick up your certificate.

Well done young man.

mattfacingsouth said...

Anonymous, o teacher,

I wish I could be more like you, but I don't know who you are.

In an effort to learn from such a wise person, enlighten me as to what "Islamo-Fascist" actually means.

Those bells you hear are me, waiting...

Anonymous said...

If you're too stupid to realize that there is a major enemy out there effecting EVERYONE that lives on this planet, then you're simply to clueless to waist my time. Keep getting your political information from pop artists and wannabe actors. It's "cool"!

mattfacingsouth said...

I understand that Islam, like many religions has its extremists. I understand those extremists wish harm to our way of life.

However, I do not think that they pose a significant threat to our way of life. The attacks on New York and Washington (along with others overseas) have done, and will continue to do more damage in the reactions they have caused than the particular, and tragic, loss of life incurred.

"Islamo-fascist" is a pet-name foisted on you by people who could care less about the country in favor of keeping you glued to the source. It's a made-up term meant to incite a partisan base and really, when analyzed, doesn't make sense.

FWIW, I think that extremists of any kind that conduct terrorist operations do need to be dealt with, but the manner in which we've chosen to deal with them has been a disastrous undertaking.

Your reactionary posting is a reminder that they are succeeding.

Pop artists and wannabe actors? Ugh. For an anonymous handle like Mattfacingsouth, you seem to know me well. I'm rolling my eyes, in case you didn't get the sarcasm.

BTW, Anonymous 4, Mattfacingsouth 0

You're still winning.

Anonymous said...

Oh irony, sweet irony. I love it. You're the one that is simply a "sucker" for their "side". I see that you're a parent. I'll assume you're not married and the little dude was an accident. Well, now it's time to grow up! Your son's future, and the future of our country depends on it.

mattfacingsouth said...

A sucker for whose side? "Islamo-fascists?" Heh.

Continue on with the hate, it suits you. I see you haven't gotten over your control issues, either. Berate, belittle, rinse, repeat.

And a stalker as well as a troll? I may be wrong, but you seem to have issues.

Get help.

wolfgf said...

Let's see...if we continue attacking every country that knowingly or unknowingly harbors terrorists, we will be in a war without end.

There are people who want to do us harm...no question. And they exist in cells in virtually every counry in the world. Let's go after them-not the religion they represent or the country they call home. There are an infinite number of terrorists in the world. Attempting to drive them out of one country, simply gives rise to more terrorism across the globe.

GrandForksGuy said...

Hey guys...this post originally had nothing to do with religion and everything to do with a new amenity being added to the UND campus. I'm not sure how it devolved into a petty argument filled with personal attacks.

I have the ability to close threads to new comments and I'm not afraid to do that. Time to move on, guys.

Anonymous said...

I preferred the original design, but the lines were too clean and reminiscent of the 1970s for the look of UND's recent construction.

Oh...did I miss a lot of hoopla along the way?

Matthew said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
mattfacingsouth said...

Matthew, why all the harsh language?

You make a much better point when you leave it out. Otherwise you, gasp, sound just as dogmatic.

Matthew said...

EDIT: I was just on my way to come back and remove the language I used, which was because I was irritated.

A spirituality center has nothing to do with a specific religion. Let me explain that to those of you who think this is PC hogwash: They aren't endorsing any religion (sorry, fundie christians of the area!), nor are they excluding any. It's good that this place finally has a spiritual place that doesn't have an affiliation--if I wanted to go somewhere and meditate, this sounds like a good place. You don't need to believe in God, or a higher power, or anything to be able to use this building--the only thing connecting it to everyone is that its an open space for you to practice your beliefs. Funny idea, isn't it? For me to be able to go into a place and pray to God, or Yahweh, or Allah, or just meditate on the teachings of Buddha and NOT have to deal with fundie idiots (of any religion) breathing down my neck.

I see this is a place to join this campus together--we have a lot of international students, and they aren't all Lutherans or Catholics. So stop shutting the door on things that haven't been built, and something you probably won't visit anyway because it doesn't have a priest shoving dogma down your throat.

LALS said...

Personally, I like the original design best, the current one reminds me of the Newman Center. I think it looks like a nice place to hold weddings...but that's the only thing that I can think of...hmm

TLH said...

Thank you Matthew---very well said. For some, religion and spirituality are completely separate. Of course, that is not to say they can't work together. I look at this new place as a place of acceptance and peace. I wish more would see it that way.

jr said...

Face it. UND would have built a bordello with the promise of several million from a contributor.

Anonymous said...

I think the building ruined the beautiful green space that was this area prior to the construction.